PV450/RPM value machine hours start counting up

T Takehara · Post by **T Takehara** » Thu Apr 04, 2013 4:14 am

Dear Sir or Madam,

We know that the machine hours starts counting up when the engine RPM got up to more than 50 RPM. Our customer wants to change that value and configured their file as attached. However, the machine hours did not count up correctly and the symptom is as below,

- Turn on the engine and raise the engine RPM from 0 to 1100.
- Then the machine hours counts up to 0.1 hrs at the moment engine RPM gets up to more than 50, but it never counted up from 0.1 hrs even though they kept that RPM value for several hours.
- Turn off the engine once and turn on and raise the engine RPM again, the machine hours gets up to 0.2 hrs but it also never counted up from 0.2 hrs.

It seems that the machine hours counts up only when the engine was turned on. Could you please check the attached config data if there is any wrong setup? We would appreciate if you correct their config data so that the machine hours counts up when the engine RPM gets up to more than 50 or if you give us a sample config data.

Best regards,

Toshiki Takehara

*ksaenz downloaded and then removed attachment to protect your configuration.

Post by **ksaenz** » Thu Apr 04, 2013 9:48 am

Hello Toshiki Takehara,

There are a few probles with the state machine.

It increments machine hours on exiting the initial state and 6 minutes have not passed yet.
Once it enters the run timer state it doesn't have a way to exit becuase the event condition is fired on entering the initial state.
When engine speed changes it only fires the event condition for the transition from initial state to run timer.

What it needs to do is:

Have a way to move from state to state when the conditions are ture.
Increment machine hours only after 6 minutes have passed.

I attached an example for you.

Regards,

ksaenz

alb · Post by **alb** » Fri Apr 05, 2013 3:56 pm

I built a similar state machine to increment and save a user defined machine hours variable every 360000ms if the engine was running above 500RPM (idle is 750RPM).

This machine hours meter is notoriously inaccurate. One recent unit was off 5% in the first 1000 hours compared to the engine ECM. One a few years old is off 2576 hours in 5477. Another 6198 vs. 6192, 8089 vs. 7896. Maybe %5 off nominally. I don't believe this is purely a result of my 6 minute intervals. The equipment is not shutdown that frequently.

These comparisons are against both Cummins engine ECMs and FWMurphy MeCAN devices. None are in agreement for long after the hours start accruing.

The direction of the inaccuracy seems similarly unpredictable. Some are high. Some are low.

Post by **ksaenz** » Wed Apr 10, 2013 8:43 am

Hello alb,

Event timers are not calibrated and they can be affected by other processes in the system so it is possible a difference of +/- 5%.

If you have a reliable source of machine or engine hours, or time like an real tiem clock in the case of the PV450 and other displays, you could use that instead.

Regards,

ksaenz

T Takehara · Post by **T Takehara** » Thu Apr 18, 2013 3:46 am

Dear Ksaenz,

I really apologize for late in response.

Thank you very much for your kind explanation and sending the sample data.

Best regards,

Toshiki Takehara

T Takehara · Post by **T Takehara** » Fri May 10, 2013 4:01 am

Dear Ksaenz,

According to your explanation and referring to the sample config data you gave, I made my own config data to start counting up the machine hours when the engine RPM reaches more than 500 RPM. However, there are two promblems on this config data.

1. I programmed the initial value of machine hours as "0.0". But I turned on the display first time, the machine hours is shown as "65.4". Please refer to the attached PDF in page 9.

2. I set up the Engine Running Condition as ""J1939.Engine.Engine Speed" >= 500". It means that the machine hours starts counting up when engine RPM reaches more than 500 RPM. Certainly, the machine hours was increased 0.1 hours every 6 minutes at 2100 RPM correctly. However, when I decreased the engine RPM to 700 RPM, the machine hours stopped counting up even though more than 500 RPM.

Attached is the PDF that shows the programming status of my config data. Could you please check if there is any mistake on the programming or if there is any program that I have to modify?

Your kind support and help would be much appreciated.

Best regards,

Toshiki Takehara

Post by **ksaenz** » Fri May 10, 2013 8:13 am

Hello Toshiki Takehara,

1. The machine hours variable was probably chnaged by a previous configuration and it kept its value. You can reset it by running a calculation event to make it 0 and then executing the store action.

2. Everything looks good in your configuration. Is it possible that something else is firing the Engine Not Running event?
You can make a debug variable, change its value when you enter either state, and show it on the screen to monitor the current state of the state machine.

You can also send us your configuration by PM and we can take a better look at it.

Regards,

ksaenz

T Takehara · Post by **T Takehara** » Mon May 13, 2013 4:49 am

Dear Ksaenz,

Thank you for your reply.

1. I will try to reset the machine hours counter to 0 by firing the calculation event.

2. Could you please let us know how I fire the Engine Not Running Event and how I make a debug variable? If you show me how to do that by using sample config. or other references, I would very much appreciate.

Attached is a configation data. Could you please check it if there is any wrong.

Best regards,

Toshiki Takehara

*Attachment downloaded and removed by ksaenz

Post by **ksaenz** » Mon May 13, 2013 8:44 am

Hello Toshiki Takehara,

Right now you fire the Engine Not Running Condition event on entering the Engine Running state in the Machine Hours state machine and if the condition is true it fires the Engine Not Running event.
A debug variable is just a variable you use to debug. You change the value of the variable when you enter a state in a state machine and you show it on the screen, that way you where you are in the state machine at any time.

What I did was to put the MHrs.Counter variable on the screen to see when it was counting up and when it stopped. I saw it count up when engine spedd was over 500 RPM and stop when engine speed went under 500 RPM so it looks to me that the state machine is working correclty.
I recommend you also put that monitor on the screen and monitor when it counts up and when it stops.

Regards,

ksaenz

T Takehara · Post by **T Takehara** » Tue May 21, 2013 12:01 am

Dear Ksaenz,

Thank you for your reply.

We added a Mhrs.Counter on a screen and assigned the calculation event to reset and store the Machine Hours according to your advice. Thanks to your kind advices, we could reset the machine hours and confirmed that the MHrs.Counter and MHrs.Machine Hours counted up properly at 700 rpm.

However, when we turned off the PV750 after resetting and operating for 18 min. and turned on again, the MHrs.Machine Hours got back to 67.1 hours. It seems that the machine hours counted after reset was not stored.

Do you have any idea what is the possible problem?

Best regads,

Toshiki Takehara

Post by **ksaenz** » Tue May 21, 2013 4:22 pm

Hello Toshiki Takehara,

I was wrong to tell you to reset machine hours using a calculation event to make it 0. To reset machine hours you must use the action Mhrs->Clear((Empty)). That should reset the variable properly and let you increment machine hours starting from 0 again.

Regards,

ksaenz

T Takehara · Post by **T Takehara** » Wed May 22, 2013 1:56 am

Dear Ksaenz,

I made a new state machine in the Machine Hours tab in programming to configure the event of Machine Hours Clear as shown in the attached. Is this procedure correct? Because we do not currentry have any instruments to confirm if the machine hours can be cleared properly, we would much appreciate if you check this procedure.

Best regards,

Toshiki Takehara
Kimura Corporation

Post by **ksaenz** » Wed May 22, 2013 7:32 am

Hello Toshiki Takehara,

That state machine will clear machine hours and if you have a text gauge on the screen showing machine hours you should see them change to 0.

Regards,

ksaenz

PV450/RPM value machine hours start counting up

PV450/RPM value machine hours start counting up

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Re: PV450/RPM value machine hours start counting up

Re: PV450/RPM value machine hours start counting up

Re: PV450/RPM value machine hours start counting up

Re: PV450/RPM value machine hours start counting up

Re: PV450/RPM value machine hours start counting up

Re: PV450/RPM value machine hours start counting up

Re: PV450/RPM value machine hours start counting up

Re: PV450/RPM value machine hours start counting up

Re: PV450/RPM value machine hours start counting up

Re: PV450/RPM value machine hours start counting up

Re: PV450/RPM value machine hours start counting up